Unpopular opinion: The Windows Registry, a centralized, strongly typed key:value database for application settings, is actually superior to hundreds of individual dotfiles, each one written in its own janky customized DSL, with its own idea of where it should live in the file system, etc.
The language itself has no type enforcement, the type checking is implemented within nixpkgs. This might seem like pedantry, but it really matters for things like LSPs (text editor autocomplete). I think that’s what scares some people off: it’s like OG Minecraft, you need to have the wiki/search.nixos.org open while you are doing your editing.
That being said, the type checking goes much deeper than what the windows registry does - e.g. it won’t allow you to enable conflicting services - like grub and systemd-boot - at the same time.
So can a dotfile, or any other kind of storage. There’s really nothing inherently bad about the registry. Its reputation as a place to hide things in is equal parts selection bias, users’ lack of technical understanding, and the marketing of “registry cleaner” apps.
I won’t argue about leftovers when uninstallig, some package managers do that as well, plus it’s not really the registry’s fault, that’s just bad or badly configured installers/uninstallers.
“WhY iS pAcKaGe MaNaGeMeNt So HaRd” my brother in Christ you got one broken Deb that was packaged and provided for free by someone other than the vendor, the vendor provides their own installer you could have used that wouldn’t have had the issue. You could have also used a flatpak. You were literally offered three ways to install the software on any operating system you could choose, and you gave up after the marginally simplest one failed and you were too lazy to troubleshoot it.
The donkey doesn’t even know the first thing about package management or any part of the build process, and has no right whatsoever to talk about it as if the maintainers of the stack are to blame.
But if you compare that to a user who is used to only one way of installing a system and only one way of installing new Software. Then it can be overwhelming at first glance when you are in the middle of a problem with what seems to be the only way to install packages and not in the overview of multiple package managers.
Here’s probably the worst part of that situation: He got that error, because the Pop!_Shop caught the unreasonable prerequisites and said “Nope, not doing that” and threw that “failed to install Steam” message. Someone who deserves to be the CEO of a tech broadcaster would have the troubleshooting skills to, I dunno, google “popos failed to install steam” and follow instructions on how to fix it. No, what happened was he threw a temper tantrum about how Linux GUIs never work and you have to use the terminal.
The Pop!_Shop’s flawed design (in that it doesn’t update the apt cache on launch for some reason), that bugged .deb, and a whiny little fuckboy lined up just right to take the system down.
I’m 110% with you here. Debian have make it much more difficult to break your system, so it should be stack sponge proof going forward. I still wouldn’t put it past Linus to fuck it up some other way (you know, maybe he’ll curl HTML into bash instead of a script), and he’ll still stand his ground and blame the world. And then later give one of his non-apology apologies.
Same, I was a fan for a while despite them not being great about accuracy, it was entertaining tech-themed content that I knew not to trust for anything serious. Them recommending a custom windows rom that disabled any anti-virus and blocked security updates was when I completely wrote them off. And their excuse was “we showed some of the issues on screen for like 1/2 a second, that’s enough” and refused to acknowledge anyone’s concerns were valid.
Then later it got way worse when it turned out they had issues with serial harassment and stole and auctioned off prototype hardware.
I don’t know about the windows stuff, haven’t used it in years. But back in the day installing Ubuntu was super easy (just boot from USB stick and install and mostly everything works). But a fresh windows install was a real pain like downloading drivers for all your hardware etc.
Also with LLMs getting good the less informed user can make changes they want and learn as they do with less effort so lower barrier to entry. The Arch wiki isn’t even that hard if you have a level headed 24/7 assistant that knows enough and can reason well enough to teach you something. Only if you make sure that you never expect perfection. I don’t trust people’s work blindly so why would I blindly trust an LLM? That’s the lessen we gotta learn. Use the brain lol
Yup… I have made so many little bash scripts to do tweaks or customize new Linux installs for me using ChatGPT. I mean, I have coding experience (.NET, not much with bash) and could muddle through learning bash better and making those, but this is quicker and allows me to learn in the process by asking follow up questions about syntax and core Linux concepts.
A big hurdle in any technological change is the “power users”. People that have learned a lot about the old tech and have to face that knowledge becoming obsolete. And then having to learn a bunch of new things.
The same goes for Windows power users as people who know a lot about fossil fuel powered cars.
I was a Windows power user, but in Windows 10 I can’t do anything. People be like “yeah just use group policy…” but I have home edition which worked perfectly in Windows 7/8. I could disable the anti-virus, I could disable the firewall, etc.
Now I borked my Windows 10 because I downloaded some debloat scripts and now it won’t update because update service requires the firewall service which I disabled. Fuck it, not booting into it anymore, Linux 5ever.
I use both linux and windows. I am power user. Linux cannot do all the things i need it to, neither can windows, but at least we have WSL and VMs. Try setting up a passthrough GPU just to play a game on linux. Then try setting up an AI application using docker for windows.
I get it, we all wanna root for the underdog, and linux certainly has it’s place, but i am so done seeing this “windows bad linux good” bs
Setting up a pass through GPU for Linux gaming is obsolete knowledge. Between Proton, Lutris, and Heroic Launcher I can play my entire game library directly in Linux. I haven’t booted Windows in months.
Wellp, i can’t. Several games dont boot, some boot but are wonky as hell. Good for you that you have everything you need, i do not. I use gaming as an example, but so many essentials are either not there, or wonky as hell. And that’s assuming you can keep the damn thing running without spending a saturday a month trying to unfuck your system after a driver update or whatever. Sure. I can get all the compatible hardware and do all the research to make sure everything probably doesnt impode, but at that point, why not just use windows.
I just spent the last 6 hours trying to get my home assistant VM to run on boot up because I’ve spent the last 6 months unable to get Linux to stop automatically rebooting for unattended upgrades.
I’m far from a power user but it shouldn’t be so fucking hard. It’s like 3 clicks to disable automatic upgrades/reboots in Windows.
Actually, no need for de-bloat scripts, a lot of those break more than they fix.
O&O shutup 10, simplewall, And I think O&O makes something like “AppBuster” or something for getting rid of stubborn metro apps.
Also…don’t disable windows updates, delay feature updates by 365 days, delay quality updates by 30 days and install security updates right away. If you don’t have windows 10 or 11 pro, there’s a program called “policy plus” Britec09 also has a guide for “how to only install security updates in windows 10” the guide also applies to windows 11
You don’t even need anything special to put a stop to that, it’s right there in the settings for windows update.
Look, read and think. That’s it. I don’t understand how or why so many people have so many problems using windows. Then I look at how they install things, how they don’t de-select anything and they install a fuck load of bloatware in addition to what they wanted, or how they don’t use any adblocking software and then they wonder why their systems run like shit and never work right.
They allowed their system to get flooded with garbage. That’s why the average person doesn’t like windows, because the average person knows what the buttons do, but doesn’t actually know how to use a computer.
any computer, windows, linux or mac can be shitty once it’s full of garbage. Those kinds of issues I described above this happen on every OS without proper protection, not just any antivirus, but a good antivirus that actually works, and an adblocker that works system wide with adblocking DNS.
There’s people all over the world who can be paid to do that for you, there’s guides online to do that kind of stuff on every OS that isn’t made by apple.
Idiots don’t know anything, and there’s a lot of idiots out there that think they know everything about an issue even though they haven’t actually seen what needs to be examined to find out what the problem is.
Why use debloat anything… scripts or apps, regardless. Why not just use LTSC? It’s debloated by default. No MS Store, no Metro Apps, just the Settings one (it has to have that), everything else is pretty much standard for Windows.
You mean windows 11 lite? I don’t know if you’ve heard, but the publisher that makes that might be doing something nefarious with that OS. Even more insidious than what can easily be disabled in the official windows 11 and 10
No, Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC. It’s an official release, no debloating required. It’s how Windows was like, before 10, it only receives security updates, no new features, it’s stuck in time feature wise.
Google a bit for LTSC (it was LTSB for the 2016 release, Long-Term Servicing Branch, they changed the Branch part to Channel in the 2019 and 2021 releases).
Windows 11 Enterprise LTSC is coming this year. September, most probably.
One time I used the store UI thing in Ubuntu to install a package and it made it so that every subsequent time I opened it it would just freeze. I couldn’t figure out how to uninstall it via the command line because it had some kind of lock on it. After awhile I gave up and reinstalled windows.
I gave up on Linux when the repository for my Logitech mouse dongle stopped working 3y ago. Why couldn’t I get something as simple as a fucking mouse dongle work instantly blew my mind. Never bothered trying Linux again since.
Too much Linux evangelism here on Lemmy. Linux is absolutely not as user-friendly as Windows is for non techy ppl.
Yeah that’s another difference. When something breaks on Windows people will do anything to fix it, including reinstalling Windows or buying another machine.
When something goes wrong on Linux they decide Linux doesn’t work and reinstall Windows.
I’ve had Windows installs slow down till they take 15 minutes to start. I once clicked the wrong button in Visual Studio and the computer became some kind of remote driver debugging target, permanently. Half the settings broke and every startup it would autologin as a debug user.
If anything like that happens on Linux it’s proof Linux is too complicated, but on Windows it’s just one of those things.
The difference is that, for Windows, a million other people have seen your problem most of the time, so there’s usually some kind of support article that can point you in the right direction on how to fix your problem without having to dive into the docs.
Linux just doesn’t have that luxury. If I were getting paid to solve the problem, sure, I’d probably have figured it out in a day or so as a Linux noob. But I’m not. My free time is limited. I don’t need to know much about Windows because it works pretty much all the time (ymmv).
I mean, you don’t HAVE to do any of that stuff in Windows, it’s just helps a bit.
I’m sure there are plenty of windows horror stories. But almost every Windows computer I’ve had in the last decade, both custom and OEM, has worked pretty well out of the box. And almost every Ubuntu computer I’ve had over the last decade has had problems that weren’t trivial to fix.
I like Linux, but when people compare these problems like they’re the same just are missing the point.
Sure because Error Code 0x8007057 tells you immediately how to solve the problem.
Linux error messages like error: kex_exchange_identification: client sent invalid protocol identifier “GET /robots.txt HTTP/1.1”are completely arcane tough.
I support both systems. And Linux support is so much easier. Mostly in runs out of the box. If it runs I continues to do so and If you have an error you get a specific message like above.
With such a message you either:
See right away how to solve the problem
Search it online and get a specific solution for exactly you problem
Or you can ask Experts for a solution for your specific problem.
With Windows: No systems runs out of the box, I always have to install additional software (7zip, sane browser, …) and also for anybody remotely privacy concerned have to adjust many settings (for which tools exist thankfully)
If an error occurs under Windows and I get a code like above:
I can sometimes guess by my experience what the reason is and solve it.
If not I search the error code and circumstances which lead to it online, then apply the 20 solutions presented one by one in hope one works
Ask experts which ask me to run a bunch of diagnostic utilities because the error message does not tell you anything. (Yes by now I can also guess which utility could provide relevant information, but not because Windows told me)
In a noticeable amount of cases the solution is: We can not determine the reason for the error, please reset everything (First a restart, then run this cleanup tool and if this doesn’t help just reinstall!)
I agree those kinds of arcane windows errors suck worse than they do in Linux. But I get those errors so rarely on either system.
In Windows, I’ll have something happen like my windows won’t remember their last position when I unlock.
In Ubuntu I’ll have to restart my Bluetooth service every week or so. Or sometimes the update-software modal will not take focus or accept mouse/keyboard input until I reboot. Most recently I had an app from the official app store fill up my entire partition because it spammed syslog, which broke my credentials cache, and I couldn’t even log in until I made a temporary sudo user and emptied syslog.
None of these are super difficult, but they also don’t provide error messages.
My experience is summed up as: -If it is broken in Linux, I will have to fix it, but with knowledge the errors are diagnosable and reparable -If it is broken in Windows, it has a decent chance that it will fix itself. However once it fails to fix itself, then it’s maddening to figure out how to repair it leading to the “screw it, just reinstall”
So if neither one breaks, congratulations, they both seem pretty solid.
If a fairly common breakage occurs, Windows looks weird but it fixes itself, Linux meanwhile bleats what is an arcane error to a non-tech person, maybe refusing to boot.
If a really stubborn breakage occurs, advantage back to Linux as at least a skilled person has a chance of repairing it.
Sure, but then I upgraded my working out of the box Windows 8 machine to Windows 10 and it became unusable because it has a hard drive, not an SSD. Select between running an unsupported system and being able to use your computer without it stuttering every 2 seconds…
I do admit I don’t really trust the windows upgrade process. Not for any specific reason, just vibes.
I haven’t used an HDD in a long time, so idk the current state of affairs, but when win10 first came out, HDDs were fine. That’s a bummer though, and win10 is more expensive both in the cost of the OS itself and in the hardware you need to buy for it. You can run Linux on a potato. But that’s not really the kind of issue that this post is talking about, afaict.
I’ve installed it for my mom. She mostly just checks mail, writes some documents and browses the web. She said she didn’t notice a difference, everything worked as it should.
The problem with RTFM is that TFM often does not cover the problem, and broader knowledge of the OS is required. You can’t expect every app to come with a manual that covers how the entire OS works, but that knowledge is often required to get work done in Linux.
People familiar with the guts of Linux or Windows will encounter these kinds of outside-the-instructions problems and know from experience what arcane setting to change or what 3rd party software needs to be installed before the procedures written in the manual will work as expected.
IMO, the Windows GUI lowers the bar to begin trial-and-error learning and makes the learning process faster.
I’d say out of all my linux issues (and there have been a lot) that maybe 20% are not answered by RTFM. Less than 5% of those were not answered by the Arch Wiki. The remaining 15% is because I’m doing sysadmin stuff and enterprise docs can be either hard to come by, or just not complete enough (looking at your FreeIPA). I will say that certain Arch Wiki sections are worse than others and take either a bit of trial and error or are just incomplete, but that’s also an opportunity to update it for the next person!
It does help a lot, but when first party documentation is lacking there’s sometimes not much you can do without consulting an expert. And sadly I work on my servers in the middle of the night when the FreeIPA IRC channel is dead :')
I believe that, in life, among the worst qualities is the obtuseness of those who do not make an effort to understand the reasons for things and settle on a reality of simplifications and superficiality. Linux has the educational merit of forcing us to dig beyond that superficial layer.
Me: Can you please just not change the UI?
Microsoft: now you need to expand the right click menu to access your most used actions.
Me: what?
Microsoft: and we replaced all the cpl and msc files, so now you can’t use the old settings interfaces.
Me: wait!
Microsoft: and ALL the new settings uses edge webviewer, so if you manage to remove edge you’ve fucked your install up
Me: sounds terrible, surely I can just reinstall edge
Microsoft: you can try but all links to edge on our website are just links that launches edge, because you can’t remove it - so why provide an installer?
Me: do you expect me to die?
Microsoft: no Mr User, we expect you to cry! Muwhahahaha
I’m not sure what you mean, the start button on the taskbar? I’m pretty sure it’s always been in exactly the same place and all that has changed is whether it literally says start or not, and what glyph it uses to represent it?
W11 also has an annoying snap behavior between monitors, which may have led to that decision. My left monitor is 720p and my main is 4K. On W10, I kept the monitors aligned at the top and it made it really easy to land on the bottom left corner of the main screen. Now it jumps up to the left monitor doing the same thing.
